just n from bethel

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Posts by just n from bethel

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  25

  Are JW Children Set Up To Fail In The Real World?

  by PublishingCult in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  would it be reasonable to say that children born and raised in the organization of jw's are being set up to fail in the real world?

  if so, why?

  how?.

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  just n from bethel

  Judah Schroeder - spent a lifetime at Bethel - I believe until he was in his 40s. He had it made. He was set for life. Never had to get a real job. He could have lived out his days in a multimillion dollar condo. All expenses paid to travel the world. People kissing his feet because of who his daddy was. Heck, he could've started partaking and been a GB. The next smartest thing he did though, was marry into money (Wasn't hard - when you're a permanent bethelite son of GB). For JWs - there is no better success story. That is the top of the top for JWs.

  Instead of rolling in that though, he and his wife decide it is not the most successful he can be. He enrolls in undergarduate business studies at Columbia university. I think he may even have gone on to attend graduate or law school.

  As far as I know he stayed a JW. However, I don't think he went back to bethel. He used to have a picture of President Clinton in his bethel office. This guy had higher aspirations. But it makes you wonder why? He had money. Prestige in JW land. Privilege like no other JW knew.

  If JWs - especially at bethel are the highest educated people in the world as JWs claim, what would make someone that has it all already from the JW standpoint - give it all up?
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  101

  How do you feel about the pledge of allegiance now?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for you us citizens (and those whose nations have a similar patriotic oath), how do you feel about your children saying the pledge in school if it's customary?.

  my daughter is in 3rd grade and part of her school's morning routine includes the pledge.

  when we stopped attending meetings a year ago, my wife and i explained to her that we don't agree with the jw "idolatry" classification so, naturally, she started joining her class in the pledge.. fast forward to the present: my wife and i are both non-theists who want to raise ethical, caring, tolerant children, but also children who aren't afraid to stand apart, especially when that stand isn't popular.

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  just n from bethel

  Its not that big of a deal. But the "good germans" included many who had been subject to the nationalistic rituals from young ages. That's all. Some were in the Hitler Youth movement. In 1936 that number was 4 million.

  

  I'm sure some of these parents wished they had taught their kids to think better.
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  101

  How do you feel about the pledge of allegiance now?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for you us citizens (and those whose nations have a similar patriotic oath), how do you feel about your children saying the pledge in school if it's customary?.

  my daughter is in 3rd grade and part of her school's morning routine includes the pledge.

  when we stopped attending meetings a year ago, my wife and i explained to her that we don't agree with the jw "idolatry" classification so, naturally, she started joining her class in the pledge.. fast forward to the present: my wife and i are both non-theists who want to raise ethical, caring, tolerant children, but also children who aren't afraid to stand apart, especially when that stand isn't popular.

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  just n from bethel

  I'm with you Six, I just don't see how repeating mindless chants teaches kids how to think.

  Obviously the government thinks it teaches something.

  As for good Germans, not being connected in any way to the mind-controlled youth movements - My studies in history, including visits to mutliple concentration camps, tell me otherwise.
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  101

  How do you feel about the pledge of allegiance now?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for you us citizens (and those whose nations have a similar patriotic oath), how do you feel about your children saying the pledge in school if it's customary?.

  my daughter is in 3rd grade and part of her school's morning routine includes the pledge.

  when we stopped attending meetings a year ago, my wife and i explained to her that we don't agree with the jw "idolatry" classification so, naturally, she started joining her class in the pledge.. fast forward to the present: my wife and i are both non-theists who want to raise ethical, caring, tolerant children, but also children who aren't afraid to stand apart, especially when that stand isn't popular.

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  just n from bethel

  Regarding the Heil Hitler - that's the problem. It was just words, until they weren't. At some point, when the war started, it stood for something way beyond a school yard chant. But they had already programmed the kids to love their Hitler - and to say the ritualistic prayer-like chants forced on kids at young ages didn't have any influence, is naive at best and blind at worst.

  Adult individuals knew if they were faking it, and that's fine, and many non-JWs took a stand in whatever way they could. (Schindler anyone?) - but those kids who had been indoctrinated, and went on to be soldiers for Germany - go on and just try and make the case that early indoctrination methods of chanting prayers etc. didn't help create Hitler's youth movement.
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  101

  How do you feel about the pledge of allegiance now?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for you us citizens (and those whose nations have a similar patriotic oath), how do you feel about your children saying the pledge in school if it's customary?.

  my daughter is in 3rd grade and part of her school's morning routine includes the pledge.

  when we stopped attending meetings a year ago, my wife and i explained to her that we don't agree with the jw "idolatry" classification so, naturally, she started joining her class in the pledge.. fast forward to the present: my wife and i are both non-theists who want to raise ethical, caring, tolerant children, but also children who aren't afraid to stand apart, especially when that stand isn't popular.

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  just n from bethel

  Of course there's always the danger that if McCarthy/Fascism infiltrates it's way back in America, SBCs kids might turn him in, like the traitor that he is. ;)
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  101

  How do you feel about the pledge of allegiance now?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for you us citizens (and those whose nations have a similar patriotic oath), how do you feel about your children saying the pledge in school if it's customary?.

  my daughter is in 3rd grade and part of her school's morning routine includes the pledge.

  when we stopped attending meetings a year ago, my wife and i explained to her that we don't agree with the jw "idolatry" classification so, naturally, she started joining her class in the pledge.. fast forward to the present: my wife and i are both non-theists who want to raise ethical, caring, tolerant children, but also children who aren't afraid to stand apart, especially when that stand isn't popular.

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  just n from bethel

  It's not obvious to me.

  It is however very clear that he doesn't want his kids repeating prayer-like chants unless they understand what it means. If they could really understand what it means, why do they have to be obligated to engage in this ritual on a daily basis?

  They understand what a birthday is. They understand what cake is. They understand what turkeys are and probably have a pretty good understanding of what thanksgiving means currently.

  What does the pledge mean? Just words right? no big deal? Then why say them at all? What exactly is the educational purpose of chanting to the symbol of the invisible borders that distinguish the country of one's birth from another's? Could my dual citizen kids say another pledge to their other county? Would that teach them something too?

  SBC isn't threatening anyone's patriotism here. Hell, he might even say the pledge himself - he hasn't said he wouldn't.

  If some people here think JWs are the only place where indoctrination methods are employed, they haven't quite exited the cult mindset - imho. Knowing what indoctrination methods look like should make any parent aware of any religion or government that tries to force them upon your children.

  BTW - James Woods - this is not a slight at you. I dig almost all of your posts and am open to a lot of your idealogy.
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  317

  Inviting djeggnog to discuss the blood doctrine

  by jgnat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  djeggnog invited me to start a new thread about the blood doctrine, which i am happy to do here.

  his objection was my statement,.

  "i've seen the blood video, a deceiving mix of scripture, fearmongering and pseudoscience, with plenty of lab coats in view.

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  just n from bethel

  1800s, 1900s, 2000s - by my math, as taught by the Watchtower - that is three different centuries. ;)
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  24

  Do you appreciate the sacrifices brothers made in 1927 so that we can preach on Sundays?

  by miseryloveselders in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the may 2011 km has an article on page 2 entitled, "could you share in the ministry on sundays?

  1. it was the sabbath, a day when most jews in philippi rested.

  paul and his companions were visiting the city during one of their missionary tours.

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  just n from bethel

  Every once in a while the elders try to promote Sunday service in our hall.

  They assign a MS to get up and announce there will be meeting for service after the Watchtower and to meet in the library.

  It's so funny as all of us elders watched him in the back by himself - even his wife and kids would get a ride home.

  He'd tell us he had some calls to make ... but we knew the only visit he was making was at the donut shop.

  Then it stops after two weeks. Until the circuit overseer shows up. Then all the elders go out on sunday all of the sudden.

  The elders in my hall like to go out 9 to 5, M - F, as they are retired or have night jobs. They still complain at all the people never at home.

  The funny thing is, if they went out on Sunday, they probably would get the most people at home.

  Here's a video of our watchtower conductor trying to get people to go in service after the meeting on Sunday:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxPVyieptwA

  SO - Who wants to go in service on Sunday? Anyone? Anyone?
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  317

  Inviting djeggnog to discuss the blood doctrine

  by jgnat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  djeggnog invited me to start a new thread about the blood doctrine, which i am happy to do here.

  his objection was my statement,.

  "i've seen the blood video, a deceiving mix of scripture, fearmongering and pseudoscience, with plenty of lab coats in view.

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  just n from bethel

  Mary - another excellent point I've never thought of. Without even getting into the grammar of it all as TD presents so awesomely, the beauty is the simplicity.

  If this really was what God wanted to be the end-all communication of his view on blood, then it is as simple as you put, and not as complicated as JWs make it - and definitely not as convoluted as even DJ re-interprets the WTs very policy, making it worse than the Watchtower actually does.

  Bible allows for the equal interpretation of two things: 1) Blood is sacred to God; 2) Life is sacred to God.

  If blood is used for it's intended purpose, to preserve life which is sacred - then God would actually look upon this as loving, as Chirstian. Which is why even the early Watchtower writers (pre 1944) commended those who donated blood. It took a crazy wacko health freak to twist scriptures to condemn it - and a power hungry control freak to enforce it. The rest is history. Except now it's okay to take parts of donated human blood, even cow blood, to save life - but not other parts.

  WT says 'It's okay for a mother to give her white blood cells while breast feeding, but not if her child is sick and needs them to fight off a disease. The child should die instead, even though that same child fed on those same white blood cells'

  WT says 'It's God's design that identical twins transfuse blood to one another in the womb - so that's ok. But those same twins, once out of the womb, would not be able to transfuse blood to one another in the event of a life threatening illness. God hates that, even though he ok'd it previously in their lives. He says it is not a conscience matter. They will die at armageddon or go straight to gehenna for doing what I had them do earlier. But now, I wouldn't break my own laws on blood - so when certain fractions pass through the placenta - that is to tell you that fractions are a conscience matter.'

  Yep - the WT's god is perfectly logical. As outlaw says - the WT has been telling Jehovah what to do well into 3 centuries now - but he can never seem to get it right.

  The Watchtower would have disfellowshipped Jehovah long ago for his continued disobedience to their blood policy.
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  44

  Apostate Psychology

  by Spade in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it's only fair that the psychology of apostates be assessed as they're intent on analyzing the psychology of jehovah's witnesses.

  http://www.freeminds.org/psychology/mind-control/mind-control-or-brainwashing.html .

  understanding mind control among jehovah's witnesses.

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  just n from bethel

  Alice hates trolls. But Alice is WINNING. WINNING. She's a warlock. She drinks tiger blood.

  really though - here's what every single person in the world thinks of Alice, including every single JW, but especially me:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JODwetfioWA&feature=feedrec_grec_index